podcast
Chasing Life
All over the world, there are people who are living extraordinary lives, full of happiness and health – and with hardly any heart disease, cancer or diabetes. Dr. Sanjay Gupta has been on a decades-long mission to understand how they do it, and how we can all learn from them. Scientists now believe we can even reverse the symptoms of Alzheimer’s dementia, and in fact grow sharper and more resilient as we age. Sanjay is a dad – of three teenage daughters, he is a doctor - who operates on the brain, and he is a reporter with more than two decades of experience - who travels the earth to uncover and bring you the secrets of the happiest and healthiest people on the planet – so that you too, can Chase Life.

Why Your Brain Loves an Organized Space
Chasing Life
Apr 1, 2025
Can the way you organize your space affect your mood? Dr. Sanjay Gupta answers a listener’s question about clutter and mental health. Plus, do blue light glasses really work? We break down the science behind digital eye strain and what actually helps.
If you want to hear more from therapist KC Davis, check out our episode Is There Such a Thing as the Organized Brain?
Episode Transcript
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:00:03
Welcome to Paging Dr. Gupta. As you know by now, this is the podcast where your health questions drive the conversation. And it's so fascinating to hear what's on your mind. So Kyra, who's up first?
Kyra Dahring
00:00:15
All right, Sanjay, first up we have Annie from New York City. And I feel like now is the time that a lot of people are starting to spring clean. And so her question couldn't come at a better time. So let's take a listen.
Listener Annie
00:00:28
Hi, this is Annie. I'm 22 and I'm calling you because I'm wondering if you have any thoughts on how our space impacts our happiness. Living in New York, our quarters are very tight, my room is very small, and I am wondering how organization and space impacts my happiness and whether I should be prioritizing that more to increase my quality of life.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:00:49
Well, Annie, first of all, thank you for the question. I have to tell you, um, you're 22 years old. I have three daughters who are just a little bit younger than you. So this topic comes up in our own home all the time. And my oldest daughter, she's now in college and we just had a conversation about her space recently as well. And I'll tell you it's interesting because I think when they were younger, my daughters were not great about keeping their space uncluttered, but it has changed throughout their lives. So maybe these things sort of evolve, I'm not sure, but I'd be curious about that for you as well. Was this something that you dealt with your whole life, sort of the idea of thinking about organization? Or is this something more recent? Nevertheless, you know, there's the old adage that a cluttered space leads to a clutter mind. Not everyone agrees with that, but I think there's probably some degree of truth. Research has shown that living in a cluttered environment can trigger anxiety, it can trigger stress, and it can trigger something that I've come to describe as cognitive burden. It's almost like you have a certain amount of cognitive resilience every day. If you're living in cluttered space, it may soak up some of that cognitive resilience and it adds sort of an additional cognitive burden that you don't need. So the space that we live in affects our mood, it affects our stress, it affects our overall wellbeing. I think part of the problem is that just initiating what to tackle first, how to prioritize what to tackle first, that is the big challenge. Just the initiation phase, there's a sense of chaos that makes those simple, usually simple everyday tasks, just feel harder. So that means the key is to not make yourself feel bad about it, because when you beat yourself up or label yourself as lazy for not tackling the simple task, that's not motivating. That's additionally draining. That adds to the cognitive load, the cognitive burden, the shame that we feel uses valuable mental energy, making it harder for our brains to focus and get things done. So I think there's a really important lesson in there, which is a simple one, just start. Just start organizing, just start decluttering. By the way, perfectionists, they're not off the hook either because the thing about trying to maintain a perfect space, that can also increase anxiety because things are not going to stay perfectly clean forever. And that's gonna leave you unable to fully relax or ever enjoy your space because you're always thinking about decluttering it because nothing stays perfect forever. So the goal should not be perfection, it should be about creating a space that works for you. not against you. So daily life feels a bit easier. But again, just starting, just initiating, just doing something, that's probably the critical first step. As a general rule, Annie, cleaning and organizing isn't easy for everyone.
KC Davis
00:03:52
Think about the last time you had a really stressful day. Have you ever had one of those days where whether it was emotional or work or whatever, you hit like two o'clock and your brain just won't work anymore?
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:04:02
That's KC Davis. She's a therapist, author, and you might remember her from one of our Chasing Life episodes where she discussed this link between messiness and mental health.
KC Davis
00:04:12
Doing tasks like laundry or dishes or picking up toys or whatever it is, it takes a lot of what's called executive functioning. And executive functioning skills happen in your prefrontal cortex. So it's the part of your brain that does time management, that does task initiation, that looks at something and breaks it down into steps. And if those things are all firing on all cylinders for you, it feels automatic. You just decide to do the dishes and you do them. If there's some disruption to your executive functions, you look at the dishes and go, I gotta do the dishes. And you, you can't. What happens next? You feel frozen or you feel overwhelmed.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:04:55
Here's what KC, I think, is trying to say, is that when we're already stressed or distracted, then even a small task can feel impossible, right? It's not that the task is that challenging, it's that you're showing up already stressed or distracted. And you know, conditions like ADHD, anxiety, sleep deprivation, just feeling burned out, that's going to interfere with your ability to actually stay focused and complete the task. So, KC's advice is simple when you feel overwhelmed. That's the time to break the task down into smaller steps. That can make a big difference. She has a method called, quote, The Five Things to simplify organizing your space.
KC Davis
00:05:36
'You know, when I look at a messy room, I tell myself there's really only five things in every room, even if it looks like there's a thousand, there's only five. There's trash, dishes, laundry, things that have a place that are not in their place, and then things that don't have a place, meaning like they don't a place to go. So when we use the five things method, what we do is we get a trash bag and we go, you know, all I'm doing is picking up trash. Just trash, I can ignore everything else. Now we've kind of put ourselves on a one-track mind, right? We're looking for one specific thing. We see the one specific things. We throw the thing away. We're look for one specifically thing. We see one specific, right? See how repetitive that is? So it doesn't require a lot of executive functioning to do that repetitive thing over and over and over. And once that's done, I move on to the dishes. And I'm just putting them into the sink, not doing them, I'm putting, cause that's easy. Then I do the same thing with my laundry and the baskets. And then, you know, I might pick a space in the room and go clockwise and put everything away that I know already has a space. And then I have my pile of things that don't have a place. Now that's really the hard stuff. And now maybe I can go, okay, are there some things in here? Where can I put them? How can I organize them? Or the best part, if I'm really rushed, I can just go, I'm just gonna put them in a basket for today and your space is much more livable and you have these like multiple finish lines that feel really good and keep you motivated to keep going because you have that sense of accomplishment.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:07:03
So Annie, I hope that helps. I mean, whether you're living in a small New York apartment or just feeling overwhelmed by your own space, I do think this method can help. It helps you initiate, it helps you get organized in your mind first and then applying that organization to your space. I think it's all about simplifying and breaking the tasks down, finding a small win, registering a win. Once you get something in the win column, I think a lot of the things come more easily. Plus, with spring cleaning right around the corner, I did want to give you some quick takeaways that can help refresh your space, reduce anxiety, maybe even boost happiness. So think of it like this: Organize based on habits, that means put things where you naturally leave them, maybe a shoe basket goes by the door. Add a trash can or a laundry basket in every room, that can help reduce mess immediately without requiring much extra effort. Simplify your routines, if you hate folding laundry, Use a basket for each different family member instead. That's what I do. We got three girls in the house, three teenage girls, my wife and I, we each have our own laundry basket. And finally, work with your brain. Think about your own brain. Everyone's brain is different. Build habits that fit your lifestyle. Don't force yourself into a perfect system. Your space does impact your mental state. That is true. I think most research has sort of shown that. So find a way to bring calm to your surroundings. that can definitely boost your happiness, reduce your anxiety, make you feel more content. So thank you, Annie, thanks for the question.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:08:41
Okay, you've probably seen them, maybe even own a pair, but do blue light glasses really help with digital eyestrain? Find out after the break.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:08:55
And there goes the pager...Kyra, who do we have next?
Kyra Dahring
00:08:59
Next up, we have Leni, who is also calling from New York City. And she has a question I think a lot of us can relate to. So here she is...
Listener Leni
00:09:08
'Hey, Sanjay, my name is Leni. I'm calling from New York. Between home and work, I am not the best at taking a break from staring at my computer. Because of this, I noticed that I have like really bad eye strain from all the screen use, which sometimes causes eye irritation and headaches. Is it worth it to invest in blue-light glasses? Does it even work?
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:09:32
'All right, Leni, thank you for the question. Let me start this way. A quick rundown of what blue light actually is. So there is a natural light spectrum. And when you think of blue light, it has a short wavelength. That means it appears brighter than other colors, like red or green, okay? So it's a short wave length, that means it's gonna appear brighter. Now screens, whether it's your phone or your computer or your TV, they all use blue light. As you might imagine because that's going to enhance clarity and contrast. But here's a really important contextual point. They only emit about a thousandth of the blue light that we get from sunlight, okay? So yes, they do emit blue light, but in context it's only about a thousandth, 1,000th of the blue-light we get from sunlight. And those blue-like glasses, they only filter about 10 to 25% of the blue light from screens. So most of the blue light that we get in our lives is not from the screens, and the blue-light glasses maybe at best are gonna filter about a quarter of that. Now, as you may have seen, the glasses do come with a range of marketing claims about their potential benefits. They say they're gonna reduce eye strain, they're going to improve sleep, they're to protect your eyes from light-induced damage. But, you know, when you look at the evidence of this, I think the evidence is pretty lacking. There was a review of 17 studies which adds to this consensus now that these blue light glasses probably don't do that much to prevent or relieve eye strain. Sorry to say, I wish they did. So why do your eyes then feel dry or itchy or tired after hours in front of a screen? The answer is that it's probably not the blue light itself. According to the Cleveland Clinic, the real culprit is likely something known as Computer Vision Syndrome, sometimes called digital eye strain, and that's really largely caused by reduced blinking and prolonged focus. So here's some tips that might help ease your digital eye strain. Follow the 20-20-20 rule. What does that mean? Every 20 minutes, look at something 20 feet away for 20 seconds. Let me repeat that. Every 20 minute, just look at something at least 20 feet away for 20 second. Second of all, blink more. I know that sounds silly, but people forget to blink. Consciously blinking will help keep your eyes from getting dry. Use lubricating eye drops if necessary. Also adjust your screen setup. Okay, so keep your monitor at arm's length away and consider a larger screen or larger text size to reduce strain. As a guy in his mid-50s, I've recently adjusted the text size on my screens. You know, just reduces that eye strain. Finally, take real breaks. Real breaks. That means stand up, stretch, move around. Now, one thing to note, and I think this is important, blue light can affect your circadian rhythm by suppressing something known as melatonin. Melatonin is the hormone of darkness, right? That's the stuff that helps you go to sleep. If you're suppressing melatonin, that can make it harder to fall asleep. Best fix is to simply cut back on screen time before bed. So Leni, back to your question. I just gave you a lot of information. Should you buy those blue light glasses? Well, they're not harmful. And if they make you feel better, go for it. But I wanted you to know the background, the science. And the science doesn't really necessarily show a lot of big benefits. Simple behavioral changes will probably go a long way for you.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta
00:13:09
'That's all we have for today's episode. If you have other health questions on your mind, I wanna hear them. Record a voice memo, email to asksanjay@cnn.com, or give us a call, 470-396-0832, and leave a message. Thanks for listening. I'll be back next Tuesday. Chasing Life is a production of CNN Audio. Our podcast is produced by Eryn Mathewson, Jennifer Lai, Grace Walker, Lori Galaretta, Jesse Remedios, Sofía Sánchez, and Kyra Dahring. Andrea Kane is our medical writer, our senior producer is Dan Bloom, Amanda Sealey is our showrunner, Dan Dzula is our technical director, and the executive producer of CNN Audio is Steve Lickteig. With support from Jamus Andrest, Jon Dianora, Haley Thomas, Alex Manasseri, Robert Mathers, Leni Steinhardt, Nichole Pesaru and Lisa Namerow. Special thanks to Ben Tinker and Nadia Kounang of CNN Health and Katie Hinman.